Hello! I am 99% newbye in Fasting. My target is autophagy.
I note that most of the posts are related to losing weight. Is this a problem? Should I search for an autophagy specific subreddit?
I’ve read that autophagy kicks in after 24h; OTOH I also read that it kicks in after 5 days!!! Is there a way to know if you are (or aren’t) in autophgy other than the elapsed time?
edit: spelling
its 16 hrs to elevate autophagy. 36hr to peak and 48 for peak window. one misconception is you have to fast to activate autophagy. you are always activated in autophagy, but fasting kicks it up a LOT.
when i feel fasting activated subjectively is usually at 20 hours, that’s when i have beaten the worse hunger pains. i feel sharper and tuned in.
Take everything i say with grains of salt its all different depend who u ask. george st pierre does 72 hour water fasts 4 times a year. he can do backflips and 1 arm chinups at 40 so you do the math
Some say it starts after 12 hours and peaks somewhere between 48-72 hours and then tapers off after that. Thsts why if your goal is autophagy then doing multiple 72 hour fasts is way better than one long fast.
>Is there a way to know if you are (or aren’t) in autophgy
No. Time is not a good indication, either.
The reason there is so much confusion is because there is no scientific consensus on when autophagy starts in humans or even how to measure it. What we know is based upon animal studies because with animals we can kill them and dissect their brains which we cannot ethically do with humans.
Measuring ketones is probably the best way that can be done outside a laboratory which isn’t to say that it’s a effective way. It really not but people grasp at what is available.
It not a sound practice to engage in fasting for autophagy alone because it is a crapshoot. People who are fasting should see autophagy as a bonus. If it happens it happens but if it doesn’t no big deal.
I’ll add, we’re always doing autophagy. It’s just that it kicks into gear with fasting.
I’ve heard that the sooner your insulin response is gone, the sooner it starts. Soo, keto + fasting is a better combo to an earlier rise in autophagy.
It peaks at 3 days. It is in effect much earlier than that, it just takes 3 days to ramp up. Albeit at a reduced capacity. After the three days it reduces slightly.
There’s not a ton of studies on it, but findings are showing it can start at 14-18 hours after not eating. It depends on the person, it depends if you’re exercising a bit to burn your stored glycogen.
This is why omad is a fantastic diet/fasting style to follow. Even if it’s literally only a few hours a day, you’re entering autophagy multiple times per week, every week. Instead of just on longer fasts.
This is the most up to date known times. People saying 5 days, or 3 days, or even 2 are likely just parroting things they’ve heard, but I read about this stuff regularly. Sometimes obsessively. I find it fascinating, what fasting does. I’ve been practicing it for 15 years afterall. I think the timing might also be different depending on how fat adapted you are, and how many carbs you eat, as well as if you had a ton of protein in your last meal. Protein turns off the mechanisms in which autophagy takes place. The moment you eat some(even just 10 grams) It essentially shuts it off. And fat has not been shown to have an appreciable difference on it. There’s even been evidence that autophagy continues, even if you’re ingesting a high fat diet.
So, you can get into autophagy with omad, and you can get into it by doing omad and skipping the next omad you would do. Or you can do extended fasts for 2+ days. Whatever you feel is easiest.
I don’t think it really matters how long you choose, the important thing is to get into it. It might peak after 2.5-3 days, but it’s still doing it’s work. And if you’re constant with it, that’s what matters. The standard diet that most people eat doesn’t allow them to have a long fasting window that would let it activate. Most americans might only have 8-10 hours between meals for instance, and that simply isn’t enough time.
Strictly speaking, autophagy is always happening - just to greater and lesser degrees. As others have noted, when it starts to ramp up and taper off during a fast is a matter of dispute. With mice, it seems to happen within a day, but that’s mice - which have faster metabolisms than people, so I don’t know that we can trust those numbers.